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Author Topic: What is art theft?  (Read 4378 times)

Offline Mredria

What is art theft?
«: January 10, 2008, 02:18:25 PM»
What do you consider art theft?
Of course, there's the usual kind of theft, where someone posts your picture and says it's theirs, I'm not talking about that because of COURSE that's theft.
I'm talking about tracing, referencing, pose references, "character theft". When do you think credit should be given, when do you think that credit is not necessary. Is there such a thing as stealing someone's fursona, or has everything already been done before. Do you credit for trying out people's style?
What is theft to you?
---I apologize---

 
        

Offline lolo

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #1: January 10, 2008, 03:11:58 PM»
sssssorta like:
U TKE MY SHIT
OHFUCK NO



honestly, poses, yeh, ok, referencing is fine. being able to overlay the images exactly?
a load of piss.

as far as ideas? adding on bits and pieces from things you've seen others do?
it's ok, TO A DEGREE. people can't copyright having like..rainbow colored ears or something stupid like that, so there's no reason to get butt hurt over that.
but if yer all like, "IMMA MAKE A PITBULL WITH TWO TAILS AND A BIG RED X OVER HIS TUMMY" and tomorrow Susie comes up with a rottweiler with three tails and a blue x?
that's a) stupid  b) retardhalfassed-theft
(for further info see encyclopedia dramtica: zeriara lul)


that is where i stand on that.
otherwise?
lul i don't care

OH RITE WELL UM. TRACING BUILDS GOOD PRACTICE SKILLS OR SOMETHING, HELPS YOU KNOW HOW LINES GO, WHAT LOOKS ACCEPTABLE AND TRAINS YOUR HAND BUTTTTTTTTTTRTTTTTTTTTT
you shouldn't then post and show off your tracings of other's work and be all "lol i m n artist"

Everyone had got something in hand cept natty dread

Offline Zodiac

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #2: January 10, 2008, 03:35:56 PM»
I think if you go and make a piece of art that is directly inspired by a work you already saw, you should credit the work that inspired you. Inspiration is one thing, but your should always change things up and add your own flare if you don't want to just straight up be ripping someone off.

Sure, lots of things have been done, and a lot of times similarities between chars are really just by coincidence. But, thats not always the case. When I used to be a part of the non-furc anthro-art community of DA, people had a huge problem of feeling ripped off. Amidst a HUGE community, chances of everything being a coincidence a pretyt high. But the portion I was in was fairly small, really. And somewhat tight-knit. So when one of the more 'popular' artists would have their character, and all kinds of other people suddenly had characters that looked almost exactly like it.. or had little bits and pices on it that were somewhat obviously pulled off of their characters.. people would freak out. They all think its really stupid and don't care, now. I guess it all just really depends on how you want to look at it.

Personally, if I see an idea I like and want to try and do something with it myself, I give credit to the first place I saw it just because thats how I am.

Offline Pocketmew

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #3: January 10, 2008, 04:07:58 PM»
I think referencing a pose isn't bad unless you're getting on the screen and copying it line-for-line. Hey, looking at it every now and then to make sure its halfway decent is fine to me. Tracing I think is O.K under one condition. It is only ok when you trace but keep it to yourself. Never ever post it online or even show it to your friends. Personally I've traced before I'm not going to lie. I saw a good picture and wanted to see what my character would look like that. I traced over it and went "Hm cool" and DELETED it. The thing that gets me annoyed is when people keep saying "You stole'd my pose" when in reality no matter what we wanna think---The human and feral bodies are limited. You can contort the body only so much. Of course sometimes poses will be the same yeesh.

and fursona-wise people do go overboard on that. Thinking something is cool and adding it to you character is o.k? But some people take it to an extent which is annoying. When about 100000000+ people you see with fursonas has a naruto headband you add it? Its like be original people...Then again some people go through so many lengths to be original XD Simplicity is sometimes a virtue.

Credit should be given if you took a lot of things from it, or did a really close idea. It doesn't hurt your art to credit someone else. If I reference anything I usually give credit x333

Offline lolo

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #4: January 10, 2008, 05:17:57 PM»
Simplicity is sometimes a virtue.

ilu~
Everyone had got something in hand cept natty dread

Offline Rex T-Rex

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #5: January 10, 2008, 05:47:26 PM»
Recently read a journal post on DA from one of my fave artists alerting everyone that people were taking her character's name (not her Furc character this is a character from her .... comics, anyway it's not her furc character) and changing it a bit. For example (NOTE, this is NOT the actual name): say her character's name was PuppyLove, well these Furc people were creating alts with names like "Puppy-Love" "*Puppy Love*" "Puppy_Love" and stuff like that. THAT to me is character theft. Now I see if you create a new species and some one sees it and is like "Oh, cool! I want one of those!" and they make a character who's that species, but taking the name of the actual character and perhaps even the exact coloration isn't right.
As for tracing, I've traced before for practicing purposes. Actually, I didn't even trace like a highly detailed thing it was actually a simple black line "coloring book" type of thing. XD
I don't like it when people trace some one else's work then edit it by adding something to it or coloring it differently and claiming it's theirs. As for characters with similar coloration, it all depends. If person A has a doberman with a green mohawk and red instead of black "saddle" and person B has a fox with a green mohawk and a red body (not fox red/orange like vibrant/apple red) then maybe it's a bit strange but not a matter to get worked up over. Now then, if person A has a hawk with rainbow feathers  and person B has a hawk with rainbow feathers (in a similar pattern and style) and a band around its leg, then yes there seems to be some idea swiping. Here's the thing though, actual animals with funky colors can't really be claimed  as tightly and people be judged for having a similar character (this is one of the main problems with a well know "artist" who attacks people with wolves or dogs that have similar coloration to her "wolf"). However, if you make up some thing new (or maybe you make a three-headed dragon with torn wings, a frill around its neck, 5 tails, hoofed feet, and one of the heads wears a scarf) and it's pretty unique and some one else makes a character after seeing yours with almost identical coloration, description, and for that matter it looks like the same creature, THEN the original creator has the right to get mad (but not terribly mad unless the person also edit the creator's character's name). I had art theft/copyright infringement. I also hate it when you confront the person and they play dumb or say they've had the character for a longer time than you and you copied them.
Pose copying? I've seen it before, but unless you do something just weird like the character's arms completely wrap around their body and their neck is twisted several times and their body is folded in half backwards then wraps around their body (though I've never seen anything like that 0_0) and 2 days alter someone does the exact same pose, I don't really think you can claim someone stole the pose your character is in in a pic.  If the character of the other person's work looks almost identical to your pic though, I would say they probably saw yours.
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Offline Tate

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #6: January 10, 2008, 07:50:17 PM»
Rex, please press "enter" sometimes in your posts. xD It was a good post, but spacing would have made it easier to read and keep my place.

anyway.

I consider it character theft when the person is one day a fox, and then the next, after meeting you, is suddenly a maned wolf/spider/drow, the same as yours, with the same design, except...male. Yes, that IS character theft, and yes, it's happened to me. But if they were already that without having known you previously.. how can you even be mad about that?

When it comes to having your own species... it is only really theft when the person makes a character that SAYS it is the species. Honestly, you can't really copyright something that the only difference from it being a wolf is it having no genitals and a shark-like nose. It has to be way different--something like pikachu. I don't know. But something with so little differences can't be copyrighted, honestly.

Now, pose theft? Bullshit. I remember the big pose-theft cry on DA... it was so stupid. I even saw someone ASK PERMISSION to use the pose. Retarded. As was said before, as long as you didn't TRACE the pose, whatever. Go ahead.

There are a lot of fine lines between what is and isn't art theft, and it can be, at times, very confusing... But, as long as you know you're not tracing someone's work, and that you aren't taking something purposefully, then it generally will be coincidence..

Another way to help you not feel like your "design has been stolen".. try not having a fox or a cat or a wolf as your character. It helps. A LOT.

Offline Narnia

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #7: January 10, 2008, 08:23:31 PM»
Recently read a journal post on DA from one of my fave artists alerting everyone that people were taking her character's name (not her Furc character this is a character from her .... comics, anyway it's not her furc character) and changing it a bit. For example (NOTE, this is NOT the actual name): say her character's name was PuppyLove, well these Furc people were creating alts with names like "Puppy-Love" "*Puppy Love*" "Puppy_Love" and stuff like that. THAT to me is character theft. Now I see if you create a new species and some one sees it and is like "Oh, cool! I want one of those!" and they make a character who's that species, but taking the name of the actual character and perhaps even the exact coloration isn't right.

FYI, the names PuppyLove, Puppy-Love, Puppy_Love, pUpPyLoVe, PUPPYLOVE, Puppy Love, and P u p p y l o v e, *Puppy*Love*, etc are all the same name on Furcadia. So stealing a name that way is not possible.
"The views expressed in this message are mine alone and do not necessarily reflect those of the Furcadia Art Zone, Dragon's Eye Production, or Furcadia."

Offline Tate

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #8: January 10, 2008, 08:26:18 PM»
Recently read a journal post on DA from one of my fave artists alerting everyone that people were taking her character's name (not her Furc character this is a character from her .... comics, anyway it's not her furc character) and changing it a bit. For example (NOTE, this is NOT the actual name): say her character's name was PuppyLove, well these Furc people were creating alts with names like "Puppy-Love" "*Puppy Love*" "Puppy_Love" and stuff like that. THAT to me is character theft. Now I see if you create a new species and some one sees it and is like "Oh, cool! I want one of those!" and they make a character who's that species, but taking the name of the actual character and perhaps even the exact coloration isn't right.

FYI, the names PuppyLove, Puppy-Love, Puppy_Love, pUpPyLoVe, PUPPYLOVE, Puppy Love, and P u p p y l o v e, *Puppy*Love*, etc are all the same name on Furcadia. So stealing a name that way is not possible.

Yes, people will usually just add a letter, or numbers. The latter of which makes me dye a little inside. 8D

Offline Sync

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #9: January 10, 2008, 10:34:41 PM»
referencing i have no issue with as long as credit is given(if they referenced off a piece of art anyway).
however, the issue of similar poses is more coincidental than anything else in my opinion. like this picture and this picture. while both are in a similar pose, neither was referenced off anything.

tracing.. unless the image is allowed to be(say like.. an anime screenshot), then i would honestly say that's theft. so what if it's an unprofessional photo? it's still THEIR photo.

styles undoubtedly need to be credited. that style is special to someone, and it's a bit mean to use it without credit.

Offline MissBlack

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #10: January 11, 2008, 03:59:28 PM»
Pose theft is just sheer idiocy. There really are just so many ways that you can draw a feral wolf, so an artist shouldn't be upset if they are similar in that aspect. Also, I believe in the old rule my English teacher taught me -- if you're not sure about something, then CITE IT. So if you're not sure about when to give credit... just give credit anyway. It doesn't detract from your art whatsoever.

As far as fursona's go, though... Well, I understand that people, especially in a fandom like ours, can have basically the same idea. However, from personal experience I can say that it's a real pisser to go out of your way to track down some strange animal (a saola, for instance, or a bongo) so that you can have an original character, just so that in two days there are ten others of that same species. I will always admit that I have no copyright on any animal, so oh well for me. However, once upon a time somebody copied my desc right out of their log and pasted it in their profile. Their character's colours matched mine, they had the same exact desc, and their name was different by one word. Now THAT is fursona/character theft.
~~Love is just another four letter word~~

Offline Haruhi Green

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #11: January 15, 2008, 11:19:49 AM»
sssssorta like:
U TKE MY SHIT
OHFUCK NO

LOL exactly  ;D
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Offline Mredria

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #12: January 15, 2008, 02:27:22 PM»
I think pose theft is possible, but is very rare.
There's a certain Masamune Shirow picture that I remember that had a girl dancing and was viewed from above. It was a very unique pose. THAT I'd definitely know if I saw again.
Most poses that people use though, they've been used again and again and again and can be found in life drawing after life drawing after life drawing.
It's definitely not something I would fret about.
I think that any character theft that goes far enough that everything is the same drifts into impersonation, which is a whole new problem.
---I apologize---

Offline Hugo

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #13: February 13, 2008, 03:55:31 PM»
Conscious, heavy referencing without permission and/or direct tracing and claiming of a piece of work not drawn entirely by the artist in question. Direct editing, direct tracing and then editing.

Any conscious case of committing above actions.

Offline Tate

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #14: February 15, 2008, 02:23:49 PM»
Youlanda.. You wanna know what sucks when someone is so full of fail and rips your character? Is when you're the one who gets blamed as the character ripper, because somehow it gets turned around like that. xD And once they blame ya, info like that won't help--- They're too stupid in the head to listen ('them' being the accusers)..

Offline Azula

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #15: February 15, 2008, 04:38:28 PM»
you know what's pretty funny?

having someone that loves you and admire you so much, that they base their character off of your own.

Offline Zodiac

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #16: February 16, 2008, 01:14:47 PM»
Who the hell would ever go through THAT much trouble to harass and steal?

Watching your back unfortunately is something we all have to do in this world. You need proof of EVERYTHING. Not only with your art online, but even when it comes to receipts and bills and those kind of things IRL. Its always good to have backup copies and verified information on the things you do.


Offline Rat The Unloved

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #17: March 03, 2008, 02:57:13 AM»
I've had decryption art theft (no proof) and screencap art theft go on. For the most part I don't care... but I really cared when someone attempted to steal my Fursona.  Thankfully, I know some really classy people, and she got banned from the con.

She had, apparently, registered a table as Mr. Rat, and intended to take commissions AS ME.

Not sure what that would've done for her, but I know what it -didn't- do for her.

Offline Rat The Unloved

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #18: March 03, 2008, 10:35:55 PM»
Kick them in the shins? Only if you're in possession of heavy, steel-toed, Klingon boots.

I just sincerely wish that people wouldn't sink to the level of theft. I don't release a lot stuff because I don't think people will be greatful for it. If I knew they would be I might release it. If I actually had people speak to me and ask, nicely for certain items I'd probably send them non-ripped versions.

The idea of "I won't even ask, I'll just yank it cuz I can!" is... well, dissappointing for sure. It invalidates all the work I -do- attempt to do to foster good Artist-Community relations.

Offline Zodiac

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #19: March 08, 2008, 04:24:47 AM»
Some people are just insane. If that girl had tried to sell art as Mr. Rat, didn't she contemplate that people would have caught on very quickly? Unless she mastered your style and personality, but still. Thats outrageous.

Offline MT

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Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #20: March 27, 2008, 09:01:32 PM»
you know what's pretty funny?

having someone that loves you and admire you so much, that they base their character off of your own.

*cough*Likeexp'samputeezombiething?*cough*

Offline Blue

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #21: April 04, 2008, 12:27:30 AM»
Hum, well I know this has been disputed a lot.  I constantly worry about people stealing my fursona, Blue, just because of all the art that she has.  Hell, I rarely even show the art I commission to people unless I really know them.  My character isn't too...unique per say.  Nude femme with a lot of markings.  It really wouldn't take that much to copy the design for her.  Character Designs I believe are copyright to the creator.  I won't have a hissy fit if another person with markings on them shows up, but....I would really hope that they'd have significant differences from mine.

I remember the first time I came on Furcadia and started rping, I had this admirer follow me around for a while.  She decided to change her colors to match mine and parade around as Blue's 'twin sister'  :P  It can be flattering, but at the same time, shouldn't people try to have their own unique characters to bring into the world?

As for poses, hums.  Normally I use either reference books or my own imagination for poses.  I think that as long as you change things around in your art that's different from the pose you are referencing, then it's not so bad.  You can reference something till your blue in the face, but a different hairstyle, added features like tails and clothing, etc, really makes the difference.

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Offline Disconcerting

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #22: May 24, 2008, 02:14:49 PM»
If you really need a unique pose that badly and aren't capable of referencing by eye, there's a ton of free photograph sites out there that don't ask for anything but basic credit to the photographer.  http://www.sxc.hu is an invaluable resource for me when I'm manipulating photos, but there's tons of unique poses and architecture (I will srsly trace architecture if a character is supposed to be at a rl location, as long as the photographer has indicated they doesn't mind) and objects and even just simple lighting effects.

Offline Goldrush

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #23: May 24, 2008, 07:54:06 PM»
Is copying a photo, trying to make a replica of it in different media art theift? Now you see, I don't think it is, but I had alot of people disagree. o_O
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Offline Sync

Re: What is art theft?
«Reply #24: May 24, 2008, 08:24:24 PM»
Is copying a photo, trying to make a replica of it in different media art theift? Now you see, I don't think it is, but I had alot of people disagree. o_O
as long as credit is given in full.
though most people don't so....

 

anything